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Post by Annie on Jun 2, 2004 21:44:58 GMT
Hi ! I've just had what should have been a lovely day out with my family. We went to an adventure park with the kids and on the outside I was enjoying it but actually I have been threatened by thoughts all day. Does this sound familiar to anyone because I desperately need to know I am not the only weird person out there ?I say 'threatened' because I was laughing one minute with my children and then I would remember that I can't be happy because I have had terrible things in my head and this would lead me to think about the thoughts again. It's like my mind dares me to think of an even worse one.Then hey presto theres one in my head.Is this the same for anyone else? I thought they had got better. The truth is actually I can't believe it when people tell me I am ill, I just feel like a freak.My life is over I can't even weep and wail anymore.
Can anyone tell me anything to reassure me?
Annie xx
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Post by deborah on Jun 2, 2004 23:04:32 GMT
Hi Annie its Deborah, this is your illness talking again. You are 'not allowed' to feel happy because you are on 'red alert' mentally/emotionally 'just in case' something may happen or you 'may' just do something without thinking about it .
That is probably why you cant relax sufficiently. plus this illness is giving you intrusive thoughts on top of the feeling of being 'on alert' as it were, almost like a 'perpetual anxiety' if i'm right.
I might have told you I couldn't relax when i did things with my family as i thought ''if I relax and enjoy doing X , Y or Z (whatever it was) my daughter may die, chock vomit have a fit'' ( or whatever was my fear that day).
With PNI the thoughts and feelings associated with it are there because of your fears, my biggest fear was my baby was going to die because of what i may have done or not done. So by being 'vigilant '(read anxious here ) and having the throughts telling me i must do this or that otherwise she may die etc; i wasn't allowed to enjoy anything.
You are feeling like this because the PNI has got a grip on you. On top of that the tablets have stopped you feeling up and down more 'neutral'. It may be the case you need a change in medication as this particular one may not take the thoughts away even a little or completely, which seems to be the case here.
By now the thoughts should have eased off even a little bit but they haven't have they?? Next time you see your GP ask her if another type of Anti Depressant may suit you to get these thoughts and feelings under control. The feelings are probably under control now but not the thoughts am i right??
If i can help call me Annie, you know where i am. Lots of love Deborah XxxxXX
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Post by sarah04 on Jun 3, 2004 6:41:37 GMT
Dear Annie I promise you that you are not weird and you are not a freak, if you are so am I!!, so you're not on your own. I started a thread back in February called 'When do the thoughts go? ?'. My PNI kicked in just after Christmas, at first I thought I was going mad, as I was taken over by these obsessional, all consuming thoughts. Just like you every time I got my head round one thought and felt like I could control the thoughts, my mind would conjour up another more frightening, far fetched thought which would once again terrorise me, for hours, days, sometimes weeks. Even though they were things I knew that I would never do, it didn't matter the fear felt so real and I felt really guilty just because I was even thinking such awful, disgusting things. Annie, I've being reading your threads over the last few weeks and I've noticed some similarities between your experiences and what I also have gone through with this horrific illness. I am slowly getting better, mainly thanks to Deborah's advice and guidance. I have been back to the Doctor's 3 times and asked for my medication to be increased. I am on Venlafaxine and I am now on 225 mg and have been for 9 weeks. When I was taking one tablet and was still getting the 'thoughts' I remember thinking, oh my god, perhaps I haven't got PNI, perhaps I am different to all those other women on the website, perhaps I am an evil person even possessed who has been taken by these thoughts! PNI can be a very lonely illness, that makes you feel a freak, fortunately for us this website brings us together and makes you realise you are not on your own. As Deborah has said previously, we are suffering from nasty thoughts and NOT actions. I think what I am starting to realise from this illness, is that the recovery does take time, it is a journey but you do start to become stronger and you do develop a deeper understanding of yourself. I still get the thoughts from time to time but at the moment I am in the middle of a heavy period (not a good time for me). I am due to see a psychiatrist who works at a Mother & Baby Unit in Bristol (Hurrah), so I will discuss my illness and my current state with her then. I have had to really fight for this appointment (thanks once again to Deborah), I have spent £350 on cognitive behaviour therapy which didn't help me at the time because it was right at the beginning of my illness, I have seen 4 CPNs who as we know are not usually equipped/trained to deal with women with PNI because they are trained to deal with people with mental illness not emotional illness like PNI, I have also been back and forward to the Doctors! BUT I have fought for this appointment because I know that I and my family are worth fighting for (now that is a sign that I am improving because back in January I wouldn't have said that I was worth fighting for because I was so disgusted with myself for the thoughts that were plaguing me). After 5 months of personal hell, my knowledge and understanding of the illness has increased, therefore I am less fearful of PNI now, rather than this bastard of an illness controlling me, I am slowly, very slowly starting to control it. Going back to the anti depressants, I was sceptical that they would help, I kept thinking that I was a one off 'beyond help', which was rubbish but it was just the PNI talking. They have definitely stabilised me but as I said it didn't happen instantly and I've had to have the dose increased 3 times. It reminds me of the Aptimel advert where the women goes back to the Supermarket asking for a refund saying that it hasn't worked and yet she is shown footage of the improvements that the Aptimel has made to her life. I sometimes think oh there not working and yet the other day I was prancing round the kitchen dancing and singing 'American Pie' to my 9 months daughter Rosie Mae (I would never have done this in January). I am in the middle of selling my house and recently I've started to deal with people i.e. Estate Agents! with a lot more confidence and assertiveness because they have been giving me the run around. These days, since becoming a Mum and since suffering from PNI I don't seem so willing to take the crap that I used to put up with. This is definitely a sign that I am getting better but I also feel it's because PNI has made me confront a lot of issues from my past and I now have a better understanding of myself. Before I had Rosie I did lack in confidence because of various things that had happened to me since the age of 18, I had emotionally beaten myself up about these issues and to be honest I didn't like myself. As I said PNI has made me face up to these things and deal with them and for the first time in a long time, I am starting to like myself again and I've started to ditch the feelings of guilt from the past. Finally, I also can relate to what you said about your day out in the adventure park. I sometimes find what should be enjoyable experiences more stressful because of the expectations put upon you i.e. if you go out for the day, you expect to enjoy yourself and so does your family. I have just come back from a fornights holiday, even though overall it was lovely to spend time with my family, I did find it stressful. What with the washing, packing beforehand, the travelling on the ferry, staying in a small cottage with my husband, daughter and Mum. I must admit I had more thoughts during this time and I think the reason was, I was taken out of my home environment, my usual routine, therefore I had more time to think/less things to do and I felt under pressure to enjoy myself becuase we were on holiday and I didn't want to let my family down. Overall it was a good holiday but I am glad to be back home, plus the fact I didn't have my computer whilst I was away!! so I couldn't access this website, which I always find helps me if I am struggling (just knowing that you are not on your own). Annie, I am thinking of you and looking forward to the day that we can both look back on this horrendous episode of our lives and know that we are well and truly over it. Take care Love Sarah xx
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Post by Calmer on Jun 3, 2004 21:07:51 GMT
Hi there
You are not on your own - I was on holiday a few weeks ago and really wanted to enjoy myself, but suddenly I would remember I was ill and that seemed to bring me down.
I usually got the intrusive thoughts when I was alone - relaxing etc, but I know what you mean, a train of thought pops into your head and you just build on it without wanting to - I used to do the la la la thing in my head until it went away - sometimes it worked.
I have had my meds upped since then and went on a day trip last weekend and really enjoyed it.
Hope things improve for you soon.
C x
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Post by Veritee on Jun 3, 2004 22:06:47 GMT
Dear All
I do not know if this will help or upset you. But even I - and my child is 15 – occasionally, about once or twice a year, find my mind drifting to those awful thoughts and actually having them.
I have steered clear in the past from telling you on here that I still occasionally have then – even though because they have no relevance to reality, they no longer upset me. But I was worried if I said this women would despair that they may also continue to have them.
So in reading this please understand it happens rarely and when it does I do not worry I am more likely to note it with interest and speculate about what I may be stressed about.
If anything it is now a useful indicator that I should take a rest, give myself more time etc.
It happens at an idle moment alone or if I have answered threads on here and start to think about what my thoughts were and what they were about. This idle thinking will only progress to the thoughts themselves when I am stressed anxious or feeling down on my self esteem. They are flashbacks really.
Sometimes then I can find myself having those thoughts again. However they now have a peculiar aspect and that is when I say I have the same thoughts - I do mean exactly the same thoughts and this is why I know that they are a sort of habit of no meaning.
My daughter is now 15 yet when I have any of these thoughts that involve her - they are not about her as she is now - but her as a baby!
I do not get the most unbearable, horrible and intrusive thoughts that for me were about killing Caja to ensure she would not suffer if I could not protect her from the global warming and other awful things I was at that time convinced were going to befall her if she lived till adulthood, but I sometimes get thoughts about accidentally falling down stairs with her in my arms and her being injured horribly or slipping and dropping her on my granite hearthstone and her head splitting open, or my being so ill or even dying so I could not crawl out of bed to feed her and her starving to death ( also equally horrible but at least not containing the guilt that the thoughts were about me deliberately hurting her and I had a huge repertory of intrusive thoughts of every kind !)
But the thing is that if I have them they are not about this harm happening to the real Caja who is now 15, working part time and doing her GCSEs, but a baby Caja who no longer exists!
This tells me that they are in some way now a bad habit – an acquired way of dealing with feelings of inadequacy and low self esteem and doubts often in the area of my worth as a successful mother.
Therefore although I could do without them, they no longer worry me. I think I know why I had them then and why they sometimes come back and I sometimes wonder if I should explore it further as maybe if I had really got to the bottom of them I may not have them anymore.
But then I realize they are more of an unpleasant habit. Obviously for me it is very clear as the baby I am thinking about no longer exists - that they have no place in reality and are simply thoughts.
Perhaps your thoughts are this too. Only time will tell if for you and others in the future you have the same experience with them as me. I have met a women who had PNI in the 50s who still has them now and then but like me they are not upsetting to her, as the situations her thoughts were about are long in the past.
However what I will say is I have found always the best way to respond to them is to let them wash over me and basically wash over and away to wherever they came from.
I just accept they exist for me and that they mean nothing and will go.
In my experience hard as it is the worse thing you can then do it beat yourself up because you have had these thoughts. This just compounds the problems and it can become a vicious circle.
I know it is hard just to accept you have them and let them wash over – but for me this works. I am sure everyone will find their own solution if they get these flashbacks.
All the best
Veritee
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Post by WileyKit on Jun 8, 2004 9:42:55 GMT
Hi Annie
I am v sorry to hear that you are still being plagued by these awful thoughts. Do you think they are a kind of escape mechanism?? I know it sounds strange as thay are so horrible but if life is too hard for you to deal with your mind has to go somewhere distracting.
I too would have intrusive thoughts when i was more stressed/anxious and in the end avoided all situations that would bring them on (even little things like walking round Tesco would start them up). I was lucky to have a wonderful partner and my baby was at nursery so i could get better in my own time. You need to take all the time you can to relax. For me that would be going to bed or coming on the pc, just being on my own really.
My thoughts did get worse when i started taking Prozac and progressed from thought to urges and finally to actions. They were always thoughts of self-harm for me but for others it is different.
I do sometimes have visions of dropping my baby but i am not worried about this. My partner says that these thoughts also jump inot his head too, i think it is a way of making you realise what would happen if you did do something like that and it makes you even more careful. So what i am trying to say, in a roundabout way, is that the thoughts of bad things happening to our kiddies are a way of making us more alert and protective of them. Everybody has an imagination so i am sure everyone has imagined awful things happening, but we are more sensitive to it, being ill.
I don't know what you can do to get rid of these thoughts, i had my medication increased and had regular visits to the gp and was referred to a psychiatrist. With all this help they finally went and i am actually happy when i wake up in the morning, which i never thought i would be again.
Take care Annie, and let us know how you're doing,
Janine xx
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