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Post by stephy on Oct 4, 2004 13:30:57 GMT
For the last couple of months atleast I have found everything makes me angry as all I want to do is nothing. I have zero motivation to do the simplest of things. but at the same time when I look at my daughter, my heart melts and I think of nothing else. She is nearly 8 months. I have been signed of sick from work as I just cant seem to cope with normal every day things. I am a teacher And I have gone back full time. (Trying to negotiate part time)
Silly things like not being able to find a pen seem to through me over the edge and I feel overly anxious(understatement!)
I have suffered from stress/depression before
could It be PNI? or do I just need to pull myself together and get on with it I am so worried that I am never going to feel well enough to work again. I am sitting on the computer at work not even wanting to face anyone as I can't seem to express how I feel inside.
I want to curl up and hide
All the time I have thoughts of things happening to Mia and how I would not want to live if anything did happen to her
My other half is worried about money and this is why I felt I had to go back to work full time> He makes me feel selfish as he says how do i Think he feels when he has only spent a week with our daughter
Being back at work, I feel exhaused and that there is not enough time in a day to do everything. I feel such despair! I feel I have rambled but thats how my head is at the moment
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Bear24 not logged on
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Post by Bear24 not logged on on Oct 4, 2004 14:40:31 GMT
Hi Stephy
I am a stay at home mum and find it exhausting and hard to get organised, so I can only imagine how stressful it is for you working full-time. You sound very busy so it could just be stress that is causing you to feel this way, but having said that, I had similar symptoms to you when in the early stages of PNI - feeling angry, wanting to hide from the world, obsessive thoughts, feeling anxious.
I think you should see your doctor as soon as possible so that if you do have PNI, they can get your started on suitable treatment straight away. If you do have PNI and it's left untreated you will just start feeling worse and worse.
Let us know how you go, Regards Bear24
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Post by stephy on Oct 5, 2004 10:52:05 GMT
Thank Bear24
I have made an appointment with my doctor for next monday and he has signed me off work. I feel really tired and washed out today. I have taken my daughter to the nursery. I just want to curl up in bed and sleep. The housework has been piling up for days but I just don,t care. I just think that if I go to sleep for a while that when I wake up I will feel more with it. I,ve been feeling like that for ages.
I'm sleeping better at night because of the sleeping tablets. When I went to the doctor a little while ago complaining of stress and anxiety attacks, he prescribed me prozac. This hasn't really kicked in yet. If I go back to him on mondays and he thinks that I might have a bit of PMI, is this one of the drugs that they use anyway?
It would be good to know as I will feel that I am helping myself get better already
Stephy
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Ryn
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Post by Ryn on Oct 5, 2004 11:20:10 GMT
Hi Stephy, Good to hear you are going to see your GP, they will be able to help I am sure.
In the mean time make sure you make the most of any free time you do have. If your daughter is at nursery they do get some rest and take a nap. I think sleep is incredibly important, I feel so much worse if I am short on sleep. So don't feel guilty about catching up on it. It is what you need to get better. Don't worry about house work that can wait....
I also had sleeping tablet for a couple of weeks while the prozac kicked in. Once the prozac started to work for me, I didn't feel so anxious and didn't need the sleeping tablets. I was prescribed prozac for my PNI - it has worked pretty well for me so far, though I have had a bit of anxiety recently (see my recent post) but I think/hope this is just down to recent stresses.
It takes at least two weeks for the prozac to start to take effect, and can then take up to 6-8 weeks to get the full effect. For me - it did kick in at two weeks, and things did just get better and better. If you have been taking it longer than this then you should chat with your doctor again as maybe it is not the right med for you, or you need to up the dose.
Hope that help, and that things go well with your GP. Let us know how you go. Kathy
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Post by Bear24 not logged on on Oct 5, 2004 11:37:30 GMT
Prozac is one of the drugs used to treat depression and Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD) which can cause obsessive thoughts. It's an anti-depressant and they can take a few weeks to kick in. Sometimes (like in my case) you need higher than normal doses to combat the symptoms. I'm on Zoloft and started on 25mgs but didn't get proper relief from the symptons until I reached 200mgs. So if you don't feel like the meds are working, speak to your doctor about increasing the dosage or perhaps trying another anti-depressant. Once you find the right meds and dosage you should start feeling alot better. You can find more info on them at www.beyondblue.org.au/index.aspx?link_id=1.15Also, now is the time to look after yourself. Rest, relax, take time out for yourself if possible. The housework can wait, but if you really feel overwhelmed by it can you get someone to help you out with it for awhile? I used to run myself ragged trying to get the housework, chores etc done while my bub was sleeping but I should really have been resting or having a nap myself. I've been told by several people in the medical profession that exhaustion/sleep deprivation is a big contributor to PNI. The most important thing is for you to get better, and that could take longer if you are really stressed and under alot of pressure. So be kind to yourself, look after yourself and let me how you are going. Take care Bear24
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Post by stephy on Oct 8, 2004 3:37:58 GMT
Hi
Its very early and I cant sleep. Stopped taking the sleeping pills two days ago as it was making me feel very tired during the day. (more tired than is the norm at the moment)
Just thought I would tell you how brave i think people are to talk about intrusive thoughts. I can't bring myself to discuss them with anyone, as I think that Mia would be taken away from me. This web site has given me comfort that I am not a bad person to have these thoughts and I am going to tell my doctor. I don't think I can tell my boyfriend though. I think it would freak him out!
A positive thing is that I think the prozac is kicking in as I don't feel so emotional. Is it normal to feel a bit emotionally detatched from things though? perhaps it just feels strange after feeling so emotional for so long
I am also getting a bit of control over the anxiety but having said that I am avoiding stressful situations.
When I woke up a couple of hours ago my mind was racing. I hope I get back into a normal sleep pattern soon.
thanks Bear24 and Ryn for your replies
stephy
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Post by Veritee on Oct 8, 2004 12:47:55 GMT
Hi Stephy
I hope you do not mind but I do not think I have not replied to you before. I respond less and less personally to posts because I feel as my PNI was over 12 years ago, It may not be relevant to what is happening for women on the forum now.
However I have to say I know exactly what you mean by not being able to talk about the intrusive thoughts.
Of course I can talk about them now my daughter is 15 years old but when I was ill there was no one I could tell the details to and only a few who I trusted to tell even the outline. I did not even tell my partner more that a rough outline ( and even this did not register at the time with him although he realised later how awful it had been for me)
Like you and many more I was so scared my precious daughter would be taken into care. At that time you could tell me time and time again that this would not happen unless I wanted respite and asked for voluntary temporary fostering - I would not believe it.
But the one thing I really needed to do to start to get better was to talk about th3e intrusive thoughts and have people listen but not see me as a 'monster, or judge me.
It is mainly for this very reason that I started this site.
While I so understand your fears and you may never be ready or able to discuss these thoughts please believe me that I have not as yet been aware of any thing said on this site being used in a different arena to influence anyone having custody of their children or indeed I have never heard that disclosure on this site being used at all beyond between us.
If anyone has found that disclosure on here has led to adverse consequences – please we would like to know!!
I believe that the reason for this is that the fact that you can say stuff on the internet with little accountability, which leads to the net being used for bad such as for paedophiles to pretend to children they are 14 years old - works positively in a site like this.
Yes this forum can literally be read by anyone but even if signed up as a member with a traceable e mail address you can say anything on here and you can not be held accountable.
It can not yet be used to act on such things as the care of your children etc because you can deny it had any truth or relevance.
For instance you just say that what you said was a complete fabrication and feeling a little depressed you wanted support and sympathy so you made up intrusive thoughts - or whatever just to get a response from other forum users.
You can also deny it was you that used it as it can not be proved it was you who signed up with your e mail address or that it is you using the user name.
That is why it has been safe to discuss what you like on this forum - even in great detail with no fear of it being used in some way.
But also because the net and forums like this are comparatively new and this media is not really taken seriously by professionals of any sort from social services, the police to psychiatrists etc in any way ( except as moral panic when it comes to paedophilic use - and this is really such a small minority of internet users) .
This again works against us on here when trying to get the issue of PNI onto the public agenda and trying to pass on the realities of having PNI (including the fact that over 80% of those with it suffer intrusive thoughts of one sort or another) which we have learnt by running this forum - to those in a position to ensure good recognition and treatment of PNI.
But it works for us in that women are as safe as they can be anywhere to discuss whatever that need to talk about and feel will help to discuss.
Your post did highlight some interesting issues and I hope that if it would help you, you can one day discuss at least a little of your intrusive thoughts and other symptoms that distress you the most. Although I do agree that you must always use your judgement on who to tell and when
All the best
Veritee
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Post by stephy on Oct 10, 2004 3:21:46 GMT
Hi
can't sleep again.
It is the thoughts that are about me hurting her that I find the hardest to deal with. I would never do anything to her so why does my mind play these horrid games with me.
I find it logical that as an instinct your mind automatically scans every situation for the slightest risk of harm to offspring. I guess this is where some of these intrusive thoughts come from. but not the kind of thought that I was playing out in my mind.
I have to add here that I have much more control of these type of thoughts since being on the prosac, especially the last few days.
changing the subject. with ref to panic attacks, I went on holiday 6 /7 weeks ago. I have been on a plane a number of times before and it has never really bothered me. On the way back this time I really panicked. My heart was racing and i was in tears. I was convinced that we were going to die! It was totally over- whelming and I couldn't understand where it all came from. could this be linked?
I was regularly having panic/anxiety attacks at school in my job when I went back. I would be in the loo every morning trying to pull myself together. I had to walk out of the classroom several times as I thought my head was going to explode.
I was in tears almost every day for the slightest thing.
i also found it and still do find it really hard to concentrate to the point where at the moment I think that I will not be able to do my job as a teacher. I keep loosing my trail of thought mid sentence and I really couldn't keep up with what was being said in meetings. \planning lessons was a nightmare as my mind kept wondering. keeping control of behaviour was impossible as situations in classrooms became very blurred in my mind and I just felt confused as to what had happened( have not explained that very well) basically, the job has become totally overwhelming now because they have set our workload at the max this year. The only reason I lasted as long as I did before the summer holidays was because I had a really light time table. It took all my strength just to cope from day to day and I was totally exhaused of an evening and was in bed by nine most nights.
I'm hoping that I can organise myself enough to do three days teaching when I am well enough. This puts its own strain on though as we will struggle financially. I also have the fear that people will judge me and think that I am realy weak at school. perhaps I am better off finding a new job rather than staying at this school. I have lost all my confidence in my ability to do anything.
I don't want my daughter to grow up with me as a depressive Mum. I wan't to be a good role model for her. I wan't her to be confident in herself which she certainy appears to be at the moment. My mum seemed to be down a lot looking back. She has said that she suffered from depression too! I want my daughter to be proud of her mum and think she is a fun person to be around not someone who can't hold down a job.
Gonna try and sleep now. it helps to ramble on even if it makes for boring reading. gets it out of my head enough to maybe sleep
stephy
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Post by Veritee on Oct 10, 2004 21:57:02 GMT
You also could be me I am qualified as a teacher too, and worked as a secondary school teacher but most of my work was spent with children with considerable difficulties - as a youth worker and therapeutic group worker with them - and your situation in the loo before starting work describes much of my time at work when I had PNI…...
Ironically I retired from youth work in 1999 after I had recovered from PNI.
But I also could never see myself EVER going back to this kind of work and it was the thought of the panic attacks ever happening again which means I could never risk it.
As to the thoughts. I am convinced that they start as you exploring every risk that could possibly happen to that very vulnerable, small child you love so much i.e. the what if thoughts - and in my case at least, when others undermined my self worth and questioned my ability as a mother I began to be scared that I also was a risk to her. Then my mind explored unbidden scenarios where I was the one who harmed my child! This was an awlful experience.
This was mixed up for me with my depression and anxiety which questioned such things as was it a good thing to bring a child into an uncertain world where she might face global warming, war and an uncertain future.
Both together cumulated in these horrible intrusive thoughts about ( in my case, I am not suggesting anyone else’s thoughts are about this ) at first accidentally injuring and then deliberately injuring and eventually thoughts of killing my lovely child that actually I would have died myself to protect.
This is how it seemed to me to happen but I am no expert and I just wish the 'experts' would acknowledge this horrible symptom that so many women with PNI experience to a greater or lesser degree and do some research as to its cause and treatment. As for me this was the hardest to take out of all the symptoms.
As to your daughter being proud of you - she will be and do not see the ability to work – hold down a job - to be what she or anyone else will judge you on. Children do not judge on this basis.
I had similar expectations of myself and so worked as a youth worker all the time I was ill but now so wish I had given it up sooner to care for myself, my family and give myself time to recover.
I was brought up with a work ethic that said the only important think in life was to hold down a job and work whatever was going on in your life and that if you failed at this – you were worthless.
But also I was judging myself by my perceived understanding of others standards - I felt if I gave up and stopped work altogether ( I like you went down from full time to half time) I would be judged to be weak and somehow flawed and not as good a person as the other youth workers/colleagues. However I now know this was all my own stuff as even thought I did not give up youth work until much later I stall felt inadequate and as you described it ‘weak’ I considered changing jobs but actually as this was about my own internal perception of myself - this would not have changed anything.
I did not fail – but it was at a great cost. Now nothing will get me back into that.
I thought at the time that some of my motives were financial – but I manage now and would have then.
Do you know that with PNI you can get incapacity benefit and some even get Disability Living Allowance? Neither are means tested although the Incapacity relies on you having paid enough stamps and if you need to work for financial reasons but do not feel able because of PNI perhaps you should look into claiming these benefits. It would give you a breathing space and probably almost as much money as you now get from working three days a week.
I am sure your experience is not like mine but a lot what you said did ring bells with how I felt
All the best
Veritee
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Post by Stephy on Oct 11, 2004 8:51:31 GMT
Thanks Jennie and veritee
I am in tears after reading your replies.
I am just off to the doctors so it has given me confidence to be as honest as possible.
veritee, I feel just like you said. It is my perception of mysef, not really the job as I feel that any job i do I will feel the same low self worth. thanks for your advise with all the benifits and all that.
I am frightened that I will lose my fiance over this. I can't talk to him about how I feel and I know I am shutting him out. I can't even face being intimate with him anymore but I still love him so much and would be lost without him.
may add to this later as gotta go to docs now.
Thanks again
Stephy
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Post by stephy on Oct 12, 2004 11:50:04 GMT
jennie and veritee
A large part of me still likes teaching. By golly its a tough job nowadays without all this as well. My department and my school have been ok. I guess that when (or if)I do go back to it, especially if its at this school, I have got to find strength from somewhere to not give a crap about what other people think or say. Easier said than done! I still need time to decide what to do though. I still get confused when I try and reason it all through.
If I was rich I don't think I would go back but it seems to be a compramise to do three days a week rather than watching every single penny and getting depressed about that.
I'll keep trying to get on to "you say we pay" on The richard and judy show. Slightly better odds than the lottery!!
I have got a great doctor who is very philosophical about life. I was with him for 20 mins. he has very little dought that PND has a lot to do with it this time. he has signed me off for another three weeks at the end of which I am to go back and see how things are going.
I tried to explain things a bit more to my fella last night. He is trying to understand bless him. I wish I could get the doctor to explain some aspects of it to him as It never comes out quite right when I try.
It's easier to explain that I have PNI. My doctor believes that what ever the trauma in your life that has caused the depression is, the symptoms will be similar and the treatment is similar. I have been signed up for councelling but that probably won't be for another three months. The doctors knows that this is ridiculas but has promised me that I am not going mad and that the anger and the anxiety and the sadness/hoplessness/lack of concentration etc are all the minds way of coming to terms with the trauma/life event.. If I can tell my self this and ride with it for a while then hopefully soon I will see a clearer light at the end of the tunnel.
thanx for taking the time to reply stephy p.s spelling is not a strong point of mine
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Post by stephy on Oct 15, 2004 13:51:34 GMT
Hi all Am feeling a bit stronger today although I have just downed half a bottle of wine. It sounds awfully mixed up I know but its almost that I couldnt deal with feeling positive. I am so torn but at this mometn in time it is falling on the possitive side. I'm hoping that if I go to bed during the day today (as Nanny Has Mia) that I WILL Wake Up feeling even more positive. I have been dreading today all week as it is a friends b'day aND WE ARE SUPPOSED TO BE GOING TO THE pUB. i AM SO FRIGHTENED OF GOING THAT i WANT TO RUN AWAY. i DON'T QUITE KNOW what I am affraid of but I am going to face it anyway.I have come to the reckoning that I can't possibly feel any worse than I have been so what the hell. Maybe this is why I have had half a bottle of wine today when no one will know. I am going to drive some people back tonight so I have to sober up for the rest of the day. It was only 1 pm when I had it and I have been on the site ever since. Therefore I can't go and have an exceedingly large glass of vodka that I would really love. I know that I will not get a reply before i go out tonight But I just wondered what advice people had for me if people ask me how I am. My friend who I also work with might be there and I am really worried that she will talk about work/workload etc and make me feel guilty ( not intentially I am sure but this is how I fel I will respond at the moment. ) I am not at work. Signed off sick for three more weeks but am torn with feeling that I should just shut myself away and avoid everyone until I feel more normal again.... or face some of my demonds as part of the healing process and not care if people finds it hard to accept that I am off sick but am out trying to be normal even though I totally don't want to be there. ( out at the pub that is) Even now I am thinking that if i can make the effort to go out for a friends birthday then why the hell can't I put that energy into gettin back to work and pulling my weight like a normal person. No one is going to understand that going out with friends is such a big thing for me. but it is a one off and not the same thing as going back to full on work again. I t has taken me all week quite literally and I am still not 100 % sure that I am going to go through with it. That is for a couple of hours of discomfort so preparing for a full week at work just seems imposible at the mo. If I hide away and not go out tonight I am not making the effort to get well am I ?? I am so in two minds about all this. It is easier to stay in and cry but going ahead with the harder choice might be what i need. I don't know what I truely need you see and I am very confused. has anyone ever gone throught this kind of dilema before or am I just a sad fcuk. How do I accept that I am not well but not dwell on it and get absorbed by it? ? In other words how the hell do I ge out of this cycle AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!! stephy
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Post by Stephy on Oct 15, 2004 22:51:56 GMT
Jennie
I did not go out in the end. It was bringing me down that I was angry that I didn't want to go but felt I should to please people. I went with my gut instinct in the end and I don't regret it and am happy that I stayed in. I just don't feel ready for that yet. It would have been too hard pretending all night. Alcohol would maybe have made it more bearable but I did not want to get out of control and angry.
What do I have to do to get better or does it just happen with time. It all seems very scary and I am scared for the future. I know I am doing somethings right by going to the doctor. I wish I could see a counsellor tomorrow. I hope the drugs work more soon as my brain still won't shut up. i AM TERRIFIED AND i MEAN TERRIFIED TO TRY THINGS INCASE THEY DON'T WORK AND i END UP BACK AT SQUARE ONE AGAIN. But I know I will have to. Its almost like I like being like this. Like I feel safe or that the effort to make it all better will be so huge that I can't do it!!!!!!! This is when really scary thoughts of me not being here anymore are starting to come into my mind. But I just think of all the hurt I would leave behind and the fact that I would never see my daugter again. I am too much of a coward to do anything but every so often I think that if I had a terminal disease that would sort it out. then I feel sick for thinking that. That is just such a stupid sick thing to think but I thought it so there it is and I shared it with this site.
In a way it is like I want some kind of epiphany to tell me exactly what to do that will definately work and I will be happy and confident again. I will wake up and its all better kind of thing. But I know its going to be hard as hell.
Tomorrow I will try going for a run and drink more water. I havn't been looking after myself properly for weeks.
I will try not to shut my Fiance out and I will try not to get angry with him all the time and overreact to things that he says. He just seems to rub me up the wrong way and I am so horrible to him. I don't mean to be.
stephy
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Post by susie on Oct 16, 2004 7:58:32 GMT
Hi Stephy,
I havent replied to you before but I wanted to say I think you did the right thing by not going out when you didnt want to, I used to feel that I had to make an effort to do things even if I didnt want to in order to get better but I dont think it works like that, I had a few months of counselling a few months back and one of the things which I had to work on was doing what I wanted not what I thought was expected of me and not what I thought I SHOULD!! Who says you should go out if you dont want to, in a few months time you may feel up to a night out, then you can go for it but now you have to focus on you and not others. It doesnt mean you failed by not going out I think you were brave to cancel!
I also wanted to add that at my lowest point I too thought about how it would be if I wasnt here, would my kids be better off without me since I was such a lousy mum anyway, it was only a once off thought, frightened the life out of me, took me a long time to get over it and admit that I had even had it, now I know 100% my kids need me, I am their mother, their only mother and they love ME and need ME, even if I dont get it right ( who does!) and I love and need them, just like you with your daughter, do try to talk to your fiance, I used to shut my husband out then get mad with him because he didnt know what I wanted him to do!
keep posting here if you find it helps,
best wishes
Susie x
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Post by wendabell on Oct 17, 2004 8:08:11 GMT
Hi i dont think your a horrible person for having those thoughts.If so then there seems to be a lot of us out here.I keep telling myself its just part of the illness.Not that that helps a lot but if i keep telling myself over and over it might help. I dont know why we shut out the one person that needs to know how we feel and can help and support us but we seem to.My relationship with my husband is going right down the toilet.I cant wait for him to get home and then when he does bamm i start critasising him,giving him the cold sholder treatment,hec i cant even stand him touching me at the moment.I am also a social prisoner, i get up , take my daughter to school,fetch her,go to work and shop.Thats it and has been for 5 years really with only a few occasions when i was on an up.But if i dont feel up to it i dont go out,cos i know i wont be me and i wont enjoy it and make everyone else misserable.But i know when i get better i will go, and lets face it its not easy to go out with your work colleges anyway cos of the awkward Qs.You hang in there we will be out one day. love and blessings x.x.x
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