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Post by rainydaybox on Sept 13, 2005 12:34:38 GMT
I am writing this in an effort to clarify myself how I feel about PNI and to identifty as my pregnancy progresses any triggers.
My last pregnancy (2000) was awful. I lived in a bedsit trying to negotiate a very complex purchase of a flat. It went though when I was 7 months pregnant only for the flat to be left practically derelict by the lady who had moved out - no floors, condemned electricity etc but it was a start. A home for my baby.
A few weeks after moving in, I went for a check with my midwife to be told I had pre-eclampsia, I had a c-section the next night, totally in shock, very ill and unable to defend myself, I allowed the hospital to do whatever it wanted. My poor baby was forced to my nipple so many times, then syringe fed, then cup fed as I listened to all telling me I had to hold out and keep trying breast feeding until he responded. I couldn't move due to infection and felt useless. I couldn't even bath my own baby and people kept coming to 'look' at me because I had the worst case of odema they'd ever seen.
When I left the hopsital I was still very ill, everytime my baby cried so did I - for about 6 months. I had one visit from the midwife who declared me fit and then one visit from a health visitor to say she wouldn't be coming again as she was leaving and they'd not replaced her. If I wanted help I had to face getting out of the flat (down steep stairs of which I was terrified of dropping baby), find a bus and travel across town. As I couldn't even get to the post box there was no way I was going across town.
I had never held a baby before having mine. Never cuddled one, bathed one or changed a nappy. I didn't even know how to and was laughed at when I called a relative to help me. I spent every day on the sofa cuddling my baby awaiting my husband to get home so that I could hand him over.
I never felt any harm towards my baby - in fact the opposite - I rarely put him down, never left him crying and felt guilty every time he cried as I couldn't work out what was wrong. I always loved him more than anything on the planet, I just couldn't be a natural mother.
I felt everyone was judging me and avoided letting anyone round. Our flat had no furniture other than a sofa, bed and kitchen for nearly a year. Mybaby had everything I could ever give him, countless clothes, toys, books etc..
At one point I called the health visitor and left a message saying ' please come round. If you come round and I say I am ok please know that I am lying.' They never responded.
After about 6 months I got good at lying and told everyone I was fine. They seem to have all believed it. My husband just thought I was ill from the pre-eclampsia as he had been warned i'd nearly died in surgery.
Typing all this is very helpful as I am beginning to realise that it's really not surprising I think I had PNI. I was never diagnosed and am still not back to my normal self. I am very self-critical, seen by others to be extremely confident and always the person they come to for advice, actually I am a big fraidy cat. I loathe the school playground as the other mums seem to be in groups and no matter how I try and join in, I just cannot seem to gel with any of them. They all seem to be smart, wearing make-up and have kids with ironed clothes etc... I have a sleep disorder which leaves me shattered and don't have that energy to iron things. Sounds silly but it's true. My sleep disorder was only diagnosed last year.
Why I am writing this:
I am 9 weeks pregnant with my second child. I am terrified. I barely remember any of the first year and a half of my sons life and don't want the same to happen again. I am scared of telling the midwife, why I am not sure. I am scared the same things will happen again, the same feeling of complete dispair might come back again and I don't know how i'd cope. I am anxious as I have so little energy anyway, how will I cope with two children. I am delighted to be pregnant - I feel well, much better than with my son, my skins cleared up, my nails are good etc.. My scan went well and it all looks perfectly fine. I am just scared. Things spiralled out of control last time and i've only been happier about myself this past year. Even now I don't feel like a good mother - I know I try but it breaks my heart to see my son wanting to play football when I am just too tired.
I'm not sure where this diary will go. It's my aim to update it throughout the pregnancy to try and identify anything that might indicate the blackness coming back. I hated the entire last pregnancy as I was in constant fear i'd miscarry (I have had several miscarriages). As I feel so well, I should be blooming and enjoying this so I need to find out why I am so anxious and try to deal with it.
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Post by cheshire on Sept 13, 2005 18:29:29 GMT
Hi rainydaybox
I have read this 4 times now I think and cannot put into words what I want to say other than I support you and hope that we can all get to know you better. I truly can identify with some of what you say here. Just don't talk to me about HVs!!!!!!!! Anyway, you might just be ok this time - I have two children and only had it once. I have also read somewhere that thinking you'll get it doesn't mean you will...but forearmed and looking for signs seems like a really good idea. I would do the same.
Take care Thinking of you Hopefulx
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Post by gymfanatic on Sept 13, 2005 20:32:42 GMT
Hi Rainydaybox
Please please see your doctor or midwife and explain how you are feeling. My heart went out to you to hear what you went through with your last pregnancy. I'm have the one son who is just over 2 and have had PNI for just over 18 mths. After being given anti-depressants at the start I found myself really fed up with taking them so after visiting my doctor again she referred me to the Community Mental Services. Here I was seen by a lovely woman who has referred me to an Employment Retention co-ordinater, a counsellor and accupunctuist.
I'm finding it tough going as I've cut right down on my medication and hence can feel all my old feeling coming back but I'm trying to tackle them.
I will be thinking of you and hope that you get seek health soon. I think I was one of the lucky mums who had a brilliant health visitor too.
Take care Gymfantic xxx
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Post by rainydaybox on Sept 14, 2005 7:30:26 GMT
Thanks for the messages. It's so nice to know that somewhere out there are poeple who don't think I have 10 heads and 12 arms .....
I am seeing my midwife for the first time on Thursday so I am going to print out my section of the above and if I get on with her then I intend to give it to her. It's much easier than trying to explain.
I feel a lot better since actually writing how I feel. My husband cannot understand why I am doing it as he feels it's inviting PNI and that I shouldn't worry until it happens... I can't get him to understand that by keeping a diary, I am not predicting it or wanting it but am safeguarding myself should it happen. At least I should be able to recognise it whereas last time it slipped right through and has scarred for 5 years so far.
I also thought all night about what i'd written on this forum and the abuse forum. It made me realise that I seem to see things as if I have no control over them. Everything always feels out of control. I want to try and reverse that if possible. For example -some of my husbands relatives putting me down (they do this whenever I see them), it always really hurts and I overcompensate for it by trying even harder to be nice to them. feeding them fab food, giving them wonderful birthday presents etc... in reality, they never even bothered with their only nephew's birthdays or even christmas.... My first goal in this diary is to take back control of this situation.
Next time I see them is in a few weeks at a wedding. I aim to remain courteous and friendly but not actually go over to them or fuss over their new car / house etc... I know they always fuss over my son in front of all our friends which makes me mad as they never see him and then go on about how they adore him & buy him stuff - all blatant lies as they've never bought him a single thing. Instead of getting upset, going home and crying over what have I done wrong to make them like that... I want control back.
They are like that because they are busy, totally money-focused people who look down on anyone not financially ambitious like themselves. they will never understand how anyone can not want to revolve around money, designer clothes and it's not their fault as it's how they were bought up. Their rudeness is their issue and should not be mine. As I know exactly what to expect, nothing I can do is ever likely to make them change so I wont bother. I need to accept them as they are, false promises of gifts, visits etc and all.
This is my first goal. I want to set goals like this to try and increase my confidence prior to baby number 2 coming along. It might sound small but it's a really big goal to me. I need to try and be 'me' rather than running round trying to please people and wanting them to accept us as part of the family.
I don't know if this will work so am not setting a time limit on it. I will see them at the wedding and we'll see how it goes. I have my wonderful husband and my gorgeous son with me, the knowledge of baby number 2 (I have not told them yet and don't think I am going to or else i'll get all the 'how are you going to cope in a small flat etc etc)' when I want people to be as pleased as I am.
Trying to explore why they make me feel so bad: 1. They make me feel inadequate 2. They dismiss any comments I make or ignore them 3. They make derogatory comments like ' isn't it funny how everyone from your town wears their hair in a bun like that... we call it a council estate face-lift' and everyone laughs - of course, they are only joking... 4. They gave me a present last year for the first time - a pack of soap powder called 'White Trash' as a supposed joke present. The assumption that I am so stupid I can't see through it was infuriating. 5. I get told off if I forget their birthdays but they have never remebered mine or my sons, occassioanlly they send my husband something. I always make them presents as I make most things as it's nicer - last year I made one a really lovely crystal necklace & earring set that cost a lot of money to make, it wasn't even acknowledged. 6. I feel sick at thr thought of seeing them and overcompensate by listening intently to them, agreeing in the right places and trying to generally not upset them.
How I want to fight it: I have today written a small card for my purse reminding myself why I am not worthless and why I shouldn't care what people think about me.
It says: I am ....... I am 31 and mother of a wonderful, loving little boy. My husband is the kindest man i've ever met, we have little money but far more wealth in a strong relationship and shared interests.
I have achieved lots from life, I have completely changed the course of my life from lost teenager with no mother to become self-employed, married, mum, creative and patient. I did this all myself.
Things hurt me because I am sensitive, I care about what I say and therefore cannot stand the thought of hurting others. Not all are so thoughtful so when I feel hurt or threatened it's because they are simply not as thoughtful about their words as I am. This does not make the hurt wrong, it makes me glad I care about people.
So there we have it. Goal number one. If I can regain some control (not sure if i ever had any), I might be stronger in recovering from the last lot of PNI and cushion the blow should it come back after baby number 2.
I hope this makes sense, it does to me.
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Post by yoyo on Sept 14, 2005 14:36:19 GMT
It makes sense to me and I think it will be a good move for you. be sure to let us know how things go :-)
Well done ! I'm having to implement something quite similar with my in-laws too!!
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Post by cheshire on Sept 14, 2005 14:53:09 GMT
Hi rainydaybox
I think getting some control back can really help in reducing stress. I sometimes think stress IS a feeling of/ or quite literally, being out of control.
You sound really organised and positive. Good luckx
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Post by rainydaybox on Sept 14, 2005 18:51:39 GMT
I don't know about organised but I am trying to be positive!
I did really well today on my first goal. We had our number changed today. I decided to change it so that I would go ex-directory and to cut out calls from sales / debts etc. We kept the number from the lady who lived here before and always get debt calls for her and then they don't believe I am not her etc etc... I decided with the encouragement of my husband that it should be taken control of and changed!! So I did it - normally i'd have spent weeks worrying over what if that long lost friend needs me and I am not available etc etc...
I've emailed everyone who are close friends, told the school etc... and as for family....
Normally i'd have called them and apologised for the inconvenience etc etc and spent ages justifying my actions.... this time, I sent a 2 line email informing them simply that we had changed our number. No 'how are you' or anything as I know, they would never be courteous enough to reply anyway.
I actually feel quite empowered. A tiny step but a rewarding one. I did something for me without worrying about everyone else judging it. This probably sounds really silly but it's unbelievable to me - and I am not even bothered! My husband is pleased too which is good for him - he's not usually complimentary like that.
A great result for today, fingers crossed for the wedding!!
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Post by rainydaybox on Sept 15, 2005 14:27:43 GMT
Saw the midwife today. HAve to have a dating scan before she will book me in.
I told her about my worry's and took my notes from the first entry on this diary. She looked at me like I was a bit mad which ws not a good sign. She was nice though but I don't think she understood PNI - I amy be judging unfairly so will not dwell on it.
I feel horrid. It was like the pregnancy wasn't viable, she went on about all the complications of my last pregnancy like they were going to automatically happen again. I know that I could get eclampsia again but on the other hand I MIGHT NOT...
How am I supposed to stay positive if people around me are all being negative. Even my sister asked if the pregnancy was really a good idea considering the hell I went through with the c section last time. Nobody mentions the illness - just the complications... They really don't seem to think anything was ever mentally wrong.
I'm fighting for this baby, I want it more than anything and I need positive people around me. I'm now more scared than ever and almost wish i'd not told the midwife anything. It made me feel like a failure and it was clear she didn't have time or want to dwell on it as she had to get on with her next questions... She only wanted a simple yes or no.. It's not her fauly, she has an appointment time schedule and unfortunately, that doesn't cater enough for emotional support.
I noticed her term of words included the dating scan would find out if the pregnancy was viable. I have already had a scan saying it is, I saw the heartbeat, saw the movements. Why make me panick more than necessary. My baby is fine.
My son will be home in a sec so I am off to make him some cookies and force myself to cheer up before hubby gets home.
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Post by rainydaybox on Sept 17, 2005 1:34:58 GMT
So it's the middle of the night and I cannot sleep. I bled yesterday for a bit and panicked. After lying on the bed for ages thinking 'why me, for once please let something be easy'... I realised that pregnancy is one of the few things in life that we have absolutely no control over. If feeling out of control is a key part of PNI then it's a miracle that anyone survives being a parent.
As I cannot control the pregnancy or the child that comes along, I feel positive that by trying to control the things I am able to, I am on the right road.
This prob makes no sense to anyone but me! Random, middle ofthe night logic I guess.
I just checked on my little boy and he is so cute. I know that when I wake in the morning he'll be wanting to snuggle with me in my 'big' bed and I realise how lucky I really am. No matter how horrific the lows are, in the long run, it's been worth it. No matter how many guilt trips I go on, bad days and mood swings, my son still loves me unconditionally. I am so lucky. I just feel so much for all those who have a less easy ride than me.
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Post by rainydaybox on Sept 18, 2005 16:14:53 GMT
Not had a bad weekend. Felt a bit nauseaus which is prob a good sign...
Went shopping yesterday but came home early as it hurt too much. I think my C section scar never healed properly inside so am going to ask the midwife when I see her next.
My sister told my husband she thinks I am jumping the gun to be telling people and organising things.. she is so negative. If I treat this pregnancy as if it will not be viable then i'll hate it as much as I hated the last one. I've told her that I am going to try and enjoy this one a bit, I talk to my baby already and she thinks this is daft as it's so early - I am approx 10 weeks.
I can't get her to understand, I need to be positive. Thinking the worst will happen and not buying anything until it's born is crazy in my financial situation. If I buy stuff and it goes wrong, I simply either give things away, sell them or save them for another go... I'm not prepared to live on tenderhooks, panicking every time I go to the loo that it will be blood etc... I did that before and made myself really ill. I don't have control over the viability of the pregnancy but I do have control over how I manage it.
Maybe I am setting myself up for a fall. I don't know. All these people being negative makes me feel guilty for feeling happy about it. Thankfully my husband is happy, and agrees with me - or at least says he does. It will be ok and if for some reason it isn't then i'll deal with it when the time comes.
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Post by rainydaybox on Oct 22, 2005 16:17:45 GMT
What a rocky month. It's funny how when I am really down, I steer clear of the very place that can help me. I am sure I have an internal self-destruct mechanism. The wedding target - it went ok. I actually enjoyed most of it and I didn't make a fuss of the family, just remained friendly. I'm proud of that. My dad. Typical, I get pregnant and my father decides to get in contact. Exactly what happened last time. There is no easy way of putting it - I hate my father. I am scared of him and yet always play along with his stupid happy family games. He has made so many people dislike me by lying about me - all stories of woe about how I wouldn't let him walk me down the aisle, how much he loves me and yet I turn him away etc etc... of course he forgets to mention the abuse I suffered as a child, the times I had to play part of his lies to get him out of trouble, the money he stole from me, the horrific way he treated my mother etc etc... to the world he is a charming elderly man whi is a bit frail and just wishes his darling daughter would apologise to him.... The first time I ever stood up to my father was before I got married. He had dictated to me how my wedding would be, told the whole world how much he'd paid for it (actually he paid not a single penny)... I sent a letter saying that I did not feel that I wanted to live a lie on my wedding day. That I was not going to play along any more and that I was having a good friend give me away. He went beserk and my stepmother told the entire world what a cow I am, he'd lied to her about the money so of course she really hates me... He incidently, spent the money taking her sister (his mistress - one of them) away for a weeks holiday in Switzerland. I was meant to let everyone believe he'd spent it on the wedding. Up until then (6 yrs ago), I had NEVER refused to be part of his lies, he knew he could come round and have a go at me for something i'd not done and i'd sit there and say sorry to him and my stepmother. She always believed him anyway and if I ever tried to say what a load of rubbish it was, I was simply branded a pathological lier... My father is very, very sick. I truly believe he is a real narcissistic. I do not say this lightly. His entire life is fiction and self preservation. He cares about nobody but himself, not even his wife and certainly not his children. The manner in which he can get very nasty but remaining cool is really scarey. As I child I often thought he might kill someone one day if they were in his way. I cannot even tell my sister this. So... I was relieved when he moved to France (to escape creditors that his wife knew nothing about as they were listed at my sisters address...). He always gets away with it - some criminal stuff and yet he manages to escape every time by lying - he's dying, his child needs medical treatment etc etc... even quite major fraud and obtaining money by deception and he walks scott free. He's sent me a letter saying a load of stuff about how nice their place is etc etc, not a single comement about how am I...... They are returning for a week in Jan after having a 5 week break in Kenya and want me to get in contact so they can visit. He wants to forget the past and they are both prepared to forgive me (forgive me? ??) for my appaling behaviour towards them. It makes me feel sick. Angry puts is mildly. I will have no closure on this until he is dead. Then I might just sleep in peace. I have dreams where I am screaming at him and hitting him and am frightened I wont stop... then I wake up. I told him how I felt in the letter before the wedding. He is completely ignoring it and offering to forgive me in order to play happy families to please his wife who cannot understand why he has 5 daughters and not a single one of them allowed him to be a part in their lives. Three are half sisters and only contact him in the hope of getting some money when he dies - they've even said this. I don't care about money, I just want him gone from my life. I want him nowhere near my son and feel sick about the whole thing. My husband cannot see what the big deal is - he's an old man, how harmful can that be? I don't know what to do. If I ignore the letter he'll come round uninvited to check I still live here. If I reply as I want to - with a simple - please do not contact me as you are not part of our lives anymore - he'll possibly become abusive, if I play along - he'll come round in January, be lovely to my family and go away smirking that he's got away with it and i'll be a wreck whilst my husband wont understand. Nightmare. I don't need this right now when I am trying to remain positive. All my awful scarey thoughts are coming back - I am going to be a naff mum, etc etc... it's all linked in with his letter. He makes me feel useless, hopeless and like a scared child. I can't even protect myself so how can I protect my children? Irrational thoughts I know, I don't even really believe them but still they lurk. Here's hoping he'll disappear off the planet before January. He never even sent his grandson a birthday card, how can he want to play lying happy families again after all this time?
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Post by Veritee on Oct 22, 2005 21:41:18 GMT
Hi Rainydaybox
Its lovely to hear form you again - I had wondered where you had been.
My father is dead - he died in 1996 - I was just over PNI by about 2 years .
As I read your post at first I felt detached - as if the way you are feeling had no relation to anything I had ever thought or felt and then I thought
- hang on - I used to feel exactly like you about my father - I used to say the same things too.
Its funny how a few short years of my father being dead can make me forget how strongly I felt about him.
When he was alive I felt that he was basically a complete nut case and maybe a psychopath and he had destroyed most of my childhood and some of my adulthood and that in many ways he was to blame for many things in my life..
and it could have been me saying that I would not have resolution until he was dead. To me he was an emotional tyrant who I could never imagine being free of - he was so powerful that he seemed immortal to me - but he was not and he died aged 80 - I was in my late 40s.
When I was young I loved him so much it hurt - but he constantly hurt me emotionally - and until I was in my 30s he was for good or bad, the most important person in my life and just so dominant in my life. Even after I married he continued to be very powerful in my life.
But then I seemed to find a way of resolving this, ie I still hated him but he did not matter so much but to keep it this way I had to have little contact with him.
Cutting of the power he had over me actually coincided with me recovering from PNI, I suddenly realized that I did not need his approval.
I hardly spoke to him for the last 2 years of his life -
I just did not want to know and he did die and I suppose it was resolved for me when he died as here am I 9 years later and I have forgotten not only how powerful my father was but that I ever even had a problem with him at all.
If I was asked now I would certainly not say I hated him, I would not say he was particularly powerful in my life and really until now I had actually forgotten how I did feel about him when he was alive as it was so different from now.
he seems just so unimportant to me now - even all the hurt he caused me is only a distant memory and seems to have no relevance in my life at all anymore.
Maybe I am in denial - I don't know as it just feels like it does not matter anymore and perhaps it never did.
I do not know where I am going with this as I do not think what I am saying will support you at all.
I think I wanted to know that I too have felt some of the things you describe about my father - actually their were times I hated him and I was not alone as my brothers wanted to kill him at one time , and he meant it ...
my two other siblings had similar problems with him, basically he was a very controlling man who just would not let go - so I had the consolation of knowing her really was a difficult man to have as a father, so it was not all me as my siblings had problems too
But I do not think my experience this will be very helpful to you.
Except perhaps to say that I found out that however powerful my father felt in my life when he was alive - he actually was not.
I appreciate the feeling you have that it will only be OK when he is dead and foresight is a great thing and I did not have it
But I know if I could do it all over again and have the understating that my father was only powerful to me because this was what he wanted me to believe and I believed it
( I let him be powerful ) and that once he was was not there to remind me that he became just so unimportant.
I would have been able to let the anger and bitterness float away as it has since his death - there is nothing to feed it now .
But I could not do it when he was alive so I really do relate to what you are saying .
What can I say?
If I say do not let him get to you I know it will probably not make any difference.
But the reality is your father is who he is, just as mine was who he was, neither of us can change who they were/are
but we can chose not to let them have this power over us.
I had realized this a little about two years before his death which was why I had nothing much to do with him anymore but I was not able to complete lose the feeling that he was so powerful without cutting off all contact with him.
Again I doubt this relates to how you feel and I am high jacked you dairy completely.
Your post just reminded me that once I too had a dad I hated....
But that had I really hated him and if he had been that important to me - surely I would feel this now rather than even having difficulties remembering any strong feelings about him and he being somehow completely irrelevant to my life ?
This has not helped you but I will try to think about the issue try to think of ways you can resolve this or live with it - but my heart does go out to you or how you feel
All the best
veritee
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Post by rainydaybox on Oct 23, 2005 12:11:22 GMT
Thanks for posting Veritee, far from hijaking the diary, it's helpful to know that someone else has expereienced the same kind of hatred. It's a horrible thing to hate someone and I don't suppose everyone can understand it.
I honestly think that closeure on this will only come when he's dead. Until then, like it or not, he has the power to continually wreck my emotions. It's not something you can just 'not talk to him and forget him'...
Thanks again. Becky xx
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Post by rainydaybox on Oct 28, 2005 11:00:25 GMT
I feel awful. Irrational extrodinaire at the moment. Any doubts in my mind that I would get antaenatal depression this time have gone as it's already sunk in without me realising it. My absolute worst nightmare come true.
Wed. I had a hospital appointment for a dodgy looking mole to be checked. I travelled all the way to the next town as the waiting list in my town is too long. Only to be told the clinic was cancelled and i'd have to make a new appointment. No apology, nothing. It's now going to take even longer than if I had just gone on the waiting list in my own town. My husband cannot understand my distress as it's just a mole to him. My mum died of melgnant melanoma so to me, it's a potential death sentence sitting on my arm and i'd cut it out myself if only I was brave enough.
Next up, my bank card is refused in a shop. Except they actually took the money from my account so when I went to the bank to get the cash out... they say it's already gone. The shop reciept clearly says declined. In the end, after over 2 hours of extreme embarrasment and my son getting very impatient. It transpires that their bank took the money from mine but for some reason never allocated it to the shops account.
Thu - My husband wanted me to go out with him for a family day with my son and sons friend. I felt shattered. I cannot be anaemic as i've got iron tablets and could still happily sit and stare at walls all day. Really, I could do that, no problem. He was upset that I didn't go and I went on the guilt trip of a lifetime.
Today I hear that a company I ordered a tumble dryer with over the internet hasn't got it in stock and their payment processer will take 7 days minimum to refund me so I cannot even order one from somewhere else.
My sons friend is driving me absolutely crazy as he does nothing but whine all day and isn't going home until tomorrow. I just want to hide in bed and cry. My husband is off work for the week so I have no repsite as he's expecting me to be the domestic goddess and now thinks I do nothing all day other than sleep or lie in bed.
I am so angry this has come back. It's just so flaming unfair. I shouldn't feel sorry for myself but it just makes me feel so dispairing. I feel like the crap mother of the universe today and here I am having another one.
I am seeing my midwife next week and cannot get an appointment before so I just hope she takes me seriously.
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Post by cheshire on Jan 10, 2006 18:13:00 GMT
Hi rainydaybox,
I couldn't help but wonder how you were getting on?
Hopefulx
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