I thought I might be manic

[Jo B]

I read the article in the Observer and as a consequence have now visited this site. I thought what I was feeling was possibly manic depression, but I am now thinking I may have PND.
My daughter was 2 in November last year, and was born 1 month premature by emergency caesarean after a 3 week on/off stay in hospital after I was diagnosed with pre-eclampsia.
The first few days I slept a total of 10 minutes and by the end of my hospital stay I was hallucinating, seeing ants crawling all over the walls, but I didn't say anything as I was desperate to get home. I continued to have physical complications, having to have a blood clot removed and my caesarean restiched later, and continuing high blood pressure, but the greatest shock to me was how helpless I felt.
I am the eldest of a large family, and helped my mother with my brothers and sisters - my youngest sister is 18 years younger than me. However, if my partner had not been working from home, I honestly don't know how I would have coped with my own baby. When she was 3 months old I remember staring at her realising how desperately I wanted to play with her, but didn't know how. I managed to get over this at the time by getting in the bath and relaxing with her and floating toys around for her to kick, but still get very anxious about playing with her even now.
I have avoided playgroups up till now, and visiting other mothers, as I find it very stressful because of the often competitive way they can be, and the questions they ask which make me more nervous about what I might not have done for my daughter. However I am now planning to take her to a playgroup next month when we move to our new home.
2 years on, I have daily found everything very difficult and chaotic. On the surface it looks like I cope well, going back to work after 10 months, running a new business, but underneath I am constantly feeling overwhelmed.
My partner and my friend have commented recently that I've changed, that I used to be much calmer but now I show a lot of stress and anger. I am constantly hoping that I'll feel better and more in control of everyday life, but in the last 3 months I have noticed it now takes very little for me to feel strongly about committing suicide - an argument (which I am having a lot more of) with my partner can quickly turn into thoughts of how uselss I am and how much better off he and my daughter would be without me - and yet rationally I know this is not so.
My relationship with my daughter is good, I think, considering how much turmoil and worry I feel, and I love her very much, but I am always feeling like I don't do enough, yet have a blank about what I can do.
My sex drive is now very low which is very different from the loving physical relationship my partner had previously. 4 months ago I had a run of (what was diagnosed as panic attacks) for 2 weeks, with my heart beating very painfully and chest pains, but these happen only sporadically now. Most recently (the last 2 months) I have found it very difficult to work - all the same drives are there in thory, but in practice if I go to the office I go blank and feel very demotivated.
I've spoken to my partner about seeing a counsellor, but am very very nervous about going to my GP, and also about taking medication. I'm scared I'll get labelled, or that social services will get called in - what happens when you talk to your GP about this? What's the best way to approach it?

[Claire]

Jo

I'm so sorry to hear of your experience, but alas it is soooo common. I also had a difficult delivery and various complications included re-stitching of a botched episiotomy over a year later.

I had no experience of depression, was previously what you would describe as a "capable" woman. however within a week of having my daughter i felt like a shadow of my former self, every feeling you described in your message i can perfectly recall, as you will find many women on here can. You need to understand that this isn't you, it isn't a reflection of your abilities, you are ill, and this is what this illness does to you. For me it took away all my confidence, all my self esteem, my ability to do more than one thing at once, to make the simplest of decisions, the ability of ordinary logic - like you, the slightest disagreement or hiccup to me was the beginning of the end, i felt like my relationship was falling apart (it wasn't at all) and i felt many times that they would be better off without me - i thought this many times, and it just shows how unbalanced your mind gets with PND. I finally went to the doctors when my daughter was nearly 2 - in hindsight i can't believe i didn't go sooner, but a combination of me being terrified to utter the words of what was happenning and how i was feeling to my GP as i knew i'd be in floods of tears, and also whenre i used to live, the mid wives and health visitors seemed to brush it away and gave me the impression they didn't want to know, well it made me just think "i should put up and shut up". I am so glad i went - no, the GP certainly does not involve social services and it goes nowhere but on your medical records just like when you go in with a sore throat. it is utterly confidential and affects nothing else in terms of insurance or anything like that. I too was worried about being labelled, thinking "but i'm not once of them, i have no excuse, no one has died, i'm not a single parent on benefits, no one is terminally ill, what right do i have to be depressed?" - all utter rubbish. I too had reservations about anti-depressants - and all the stigma that goes with them, but i have since come to realise that these are held by people who have no idea about depression and have the luxury of judging these things without ever experiencing them (ashamed to admit that was me previously). In the end i took up my GP's offer - i got given citalopram, and all it did was put back the serotonin that had disappeared (the happy chemical in your brain - the lack of this causes PND and all the awfulness that goes with it - amazing but true). Yes, it took 3 weeks to kick in, yes, the first week i felt very strange but i stuck with it as you must, and by the end of themonth i felt like "me" again - something i thought i'd never feel again ever. I had no side effects, i was worried about feeling dis-engaged or fuzzy - once the 2 or 3 first weeks were past,none of it, i was as sharp as i'd always been. As i'd gone so long wihtout treatment, i had to stay on the tablets for around a year then gradually reduce - if you come off too soon, you relapse. Your brain needs to be "trained" to produce serotonin for itself again, and this is part of what they do. instead of feeling bad for having to take them, i felt positive about it and glad that all my pre-conceptions were blown out of the water. Please please see your GP asap - you won't look back, you don't need to go through what you are.

Please let me know what happens........

Claire

[Karlou]

Jo B. Just remember this...you are not alone. I know that probably sounds like such a cliche, because when I was in the depths of my post-natal depression, which hit pretty much as soon as my baby was born, I truly,truly believed that I was the only woman to ever feel this bad and I would be the only woman who wouldn't respond to the anti-depressants. I spent three weeks in a mother/baby unit while the medication kicked in (which I have to say was the best thing I ever did) and slowly, slowly without even realising it was happening at first, the blackness lifted. So many of your symptoms sound so familiar to me and if I'm honest with myself, I think I still silently suffer alot of my old symptoms, however the difference is that I am more capable of counteracting the bad thoughts and rationalising them. For instance, when I first gave birth to my daughter, I didn't sleep that night, even though I was on alot of painkillers after a cesaerian (?spelling? sorry) all I could think about was putting her up for adoption because it was all a big mistake and I wasn't meant to be a mother. Even though we had gone through alot of treatment to conceive, I just kept looking at her and wondering who she was and why I didn't feel ANYTHING AT ALL for her. I think that was the most heartbreaking part of my depression and I still feel revolting whenever I admit that, but I now know that when your mind is in that state of depression, there simply isn't room for the emotion of love. I can relate to your feelings of inadequacy when playing with your baby. I quite often still feel as though I don't do enough for my daughter, and struggle with irrational thoughts that she doesn't like me or love me.
On the subject of playgroup, on the encouragement of my health nurse, I joined a playgroup and was really surprised to discover two other mothers that also suffered PND.
Please, take care of yourself and try to keep rationalising your bad thoughts. Find some support and when all else fails, think of the love you have for your family.

[Kelly Southall]

Dear Jo
After reading about your problems it was like reading about myself six years ago. I promise you will feel better and you are doing a fantastic job the feelings you have will subside at the moment everything is so raw for you I beg you to see your GP and they will try and help you I used to have thoughts that my son would be taken away but it wont happen. You are so important to your partner and daughter because you are a special person who is just struggling a bit at the moment its just a blip. I used to have all of the symptoms you mentioned but I now realise its just an illness if you had a broken leg it is visible to others and yourself but unfortunately PND isnt always visible. Look after yourself and I think you are doing a great job please let me know how you get on at the Doctors if that is what you decide to do Love Kelly x

[Jo B]

Many thanks for your replies - I can't tell you how much I appreciate the time and thought you put in to them, and Veritee's too, who encouraged me to create a new thread. They gave me a lot of support and comfort.
I went to my GP today and then had a long talk with my partner afterwards, who has been the person I have been worrying most about as he has had to fill in all the gaps over the last 2 years whilst still working from home.
My GP was very nice ( I handed him what I'd written down for this forum, as I couldn't trust myself to speak coherently!) - however he did want me to make an on the spot decision between medication or counselling, and I think I need to talk to somebody who has time with me to make a more informed diagnosis before I take medication.
However, I am now more open to medication if it is thought that is a good idea, particularly as I was offered Cyclopram, which Claire has had good results from. The Health Visitor is also going to be coming round to talk to me, and I think that is what leads to counselling being arranged(?) - I suspect also to check on the home situation and my daughter which I feel less anxious about now.
My partner has been very supportive about my having counselling - he had suggested this to me a few months ago - but I feel less confused and helpless about doing it now. It's now being openly discussed and that makes a big difference, instead of me embarassedly trying to shove my situation under the carpet (where it has been leaking horribly anyway!).
It also is very heartening knowing that this condition can be eventually overcome. Thank you all again for helping me make a big first step.

[claire]

Jo

I'm so pleased you've been to your GP - what a good idea handing him your notes from here, i know exactley what you mean when you say you couldn't trust yourself to speak coherently.

Can i make a suggestion? Of course it is entirely your decision, but i found, that after going without treatment for so long, that the condition really gets its claws in. I considered anti-depressants when i was offered them - my first reaction was not to take them (due to preconceptions, stigma, fear of being labelled, etc etc) but i realised i needed to do something to give me the initial "push" out of the depression, and figured that as i had been suffering for 2 years already, i thought "well what can i lose??" i started the anti-depressants immediately, then following that, combined it with counselling. They worked beautifully together. A lot of people feel very uncomfortable about taking medication, so when they start taking them and feel strange (the first week i found it difficult to sleep and certainly the first couple of days i felt more anxious) but it was such a small price to pay for the enormous benefits when they kicked in - but people who are uncomfortable with the thought of taking them will sometimes give up after a few days, which is such a shame. It takes perserverance, but is so worth it.

Your health visitor's main reason for visiting is you - their remit is to look after the child until it reaches 5 and also the mother - just as important, they are there for you too. There is no question that she will be examining your interactions with your child and judging you, she is there to bring you all the knowledge and experience she has with mums with PND - i found mine so helpful i was shocked!

I was prescribed citalopram, also called cipramil. after 2 weeks,it was like someone had switched the lights back on, and the pre-pregnancy "me" came back.

Please let me know how you get on - i bet both you & your partner are so relieved - just making that first step (which took me so long to do) is such a relief but so hard, it spurs you on to more. Well done!!

ClaireXX

[Kelly]

:)Hi Jo,

I am so glad to hear that you visited your GP and believe me this is the first step to your recovery. Don't worry about the visit from the Health Visitor she will be able to help you emotionally and practically. The support on this site is amazing and as I have said before I wish this was available to me six years ago everyone is so kind - we have bonded through our experiences and what has amazed me is the similarity of our experiences I genuinally thought I was the only woman on earth who was feeling like that. I have recovered and you and all the other woman feeling like this will too I know its not funny but sometimes I have a little giggle to myself about things I used to do and the feelings I used to have it has made me stronger and more sensitive to other people - please understand when I say I have a little giggle I am not trying to belittle yours or anyone else's feelings because I know how real it all feels at the time. Be kind to yourself and let us know what you decide to do about the medication etc if this helps I took the medication and I am not exaggerating by saying this - I was 90% back to myself within three weeks my family, partner and friends could not believe it they were very effective for me- the downside is unfortunately I am still on them six years on I have found it hard to come off that Seroxat never mind I have coped with PND I know I can come off the medication.

Take Care

Love Kelly xx

[Karlou]

I just had to pop back in to check how you were going and I'm so glad to see that you did visit your gp and talk to your partner. In my experience, I believe that medication works wonders, but only with the added help of counselling. In conjunction with the hopeless depression that I felt I also suffered tremendously with anxiety. After taking Zoloft for over a year now, (currently in the process of coming offmedication) I found that my anxiety levels still have the potential to get a bit out of control and mess with my head, but I have found that I have learnt to deal with that myself through counselling.
Anyway, good luck with your decision, you need to do what is right for you. Take care.